Odds Updates

[SneakyDave]

Do you have a FAQ on how to update odds for events, I normally don't do that for some events, but sometimes I do.

Do I just update the outcomes to the new odds?

Then when the event is over, I don't understand how I would pick a winner.

I'm probably just ignorant on how updating the event odds works.

 

[SneakyDave]

ok, looking at this again, I don't think that the odds updates would work the way I'm using sportsbook(er).

The way I have my events set up is the title will be something like "Steelers (-30) vs. Raiders (+30)". Then the outcomes are 1/1 for the Steelers -30 or Raiders +30.

So the odds are always 1/1 in this case. Is that a good way to do it, or is there a better way to pick those point spread bets?

 

[Bob]

Ya, that is NOT correct.

The EVENT, is the MAJOR thing that is happening, which is the Football game. The EVENT is Raiders @ Steelers.

Outcomes are the things that people place wagers on.

Raiders +30 is an OUTCOME
Steelers -30 is an OUTCOME
Big Ben throws 6 TD's in the First Half

You assign payout odds for each outcome. Payout Odds are "floating" meaning that you can edit them as the game gets closer. However, once a wager has been placed, that specific wager is locked in on the odds at the time of the wager.

Raiders +30 (100 to 110)
Steelers -30 (110 to 100)
Big Ben throws 6 TD's in the First Half (25 to 1)
Oakland wins the coin toss (100 to 110)
Raiders score first (100 to 110)
First score is a Touchdown (either team) (100 to 110)
etc etc etc

As you can see, there are several different types of outcomes that all can be in the same EVENT. Each outcome is its OWN thing. Each outcome either pays out or it doesn't. Its not dependent on another outcome.

When the event is over, you settle the event by marking outcomes that payout or push. Each outcome has 3 possibilities. It can be marked as "Pay Out", marked as a PUSH or left unmarked which means do not pay out (which is default). A PUSH is when an outcome results in a tie with another outcome... ie, if you have 2 ML (Moneyline) outcomes and the game ends in a tie, both those will push. This comes up from time to time in the NFL as an example. A PUSH returns the stakes only (not the payout).

You can have 1000's out outcomes on an individual event.

You can also do events that are not individual team specific ie, Week 12 Props or Week 12 Parlays.

EVENT: Week 13 Parlays

Outcome: The Dirty Bird Gets the Worm (Falcons, Seahawks, Cardinals and Eagles all win) (3 to 1)
Outcome: West Coast Rules (Raiders, Chargers, Niners, Seahawks all win) (5-1)
Outcome: AFC West Rules (Raiders, Chargers, Broncos, Chiefs all win) (25-1)

Then when the week is over, to settle, you payout each outcome that actually did what it said.... ie, if the Raiders, Chiefs, Broncos and Chargers all won their games, then that outcome would payout (same applies to the other outcomes).

EVENT: Week 13 Props

Outcome: Any Team scores a Safety (5 to 1)
Outcome: Tom Brady throws 7 INTS (25 to 1)
Outcome: An opposing team desecrates the Terrible Towel (5 to 1)
Outcome: A Raider fan doesn't something stupid on national TV (150 to 100)

Then just like the Parlays, you have to wait until after ALL games are over and then pay out the winning outcomes.

As far as changing odds go..... remember, ODDS are PAYOUT ODDS, not odds on whether it will happen or not. If you assign the PAYOUT ODDS of 5 to 1 on something, that doesn't mean there is a 5 to 1 chance that it might happen, that means IF it happens, for every 1 they stake, they WIN 5 (plus their stake back).

So lets look at this one. Current odds are a standard Vegas DIME. As the event gets closer, you may have to adjust the payout odds (as you can't change the +30 or -30 as that changes the outcome).
Raiders +30 (100 to 110)
Steelers -30 (110 to 100)

You can create several different spreads with different payout odds.

Raiders +30 (100 to 110)
Steelers -30 (110 to 100)
Raiders +15 (100 to 110)
Steelers -15 (110 to 100)
Raiders -3 (100 to 110)
Steelers +3 (110 to 100)
Raiders -30 (100 to 110)
Steelers +30 (110 to 100)

THen obviously, mark the ones that are TRUE that will payout.

 

[Bob]

Remember, you CAN NOT CHANGE the OUTCOME.

IE.. Raiders +30 CAN NOT be changed to Raiders +25 as that would be the same as having an Outcome: Big Ben throws 6 TDs in a game, having people places wagers on it and then changing Big Ben to JaMarcus Russell.

When wagers are placed on an OUTCOME, those wagers are locked in on the Payout Odds for the outcome, not the outcome title (which is why you can't just change the outcome title)

 

[Bob]

Also, another thing to remember, each outcome has the ability to not only set/change the payout odds, it also has fields for MAX WAGERS, Min Wager amount and Max Wager amount (which can all be changed at any point).

You could open an outcome with the Max Wagers a person can place to unlimited, then change the payout odds and set the max wagers to 1 (those that placed wagers before the change won't be effected). This comes in handy if you want to introduce new spread outcomes and limit wagers on the earlier ones.

 

[SneakyDave]

Got it , I usually just do pointspread bets, but I can see some more flexible options with ML and other bets.

 

[Bob]

Ya, the way it is makes it pretty flexible. I've been toying around with some other wagering types (like member vs member wagers). Also looking into auto adjusting payouts based on percentages of wagers placed.

 

[SneakyDave]

OK, so in your examples above, regarding the steelers and raiders, your ML bets of 110 to 100, you have to risk 110 to win 100, right? If there is no vig to the bookeeper, the odds would be 100 to 100, right?

 

[Bob]

just FYI... there is no Juice/Vigorish built into sportsbook.. its not about the OWNER or Bookies, its about the site members.

Payout Odds are simple basic math and they are 100% used for determining winnings. Its ALL (100% of it) about the Members and what they will be paid if they win.

The Payout Odds Math = (wager amount placed * the first number) / (the second number) $100 stake on 100 to 110 = ($100 * 100) / (110) PLUS you always get your STAKE returned when you win. The STAKE is never PART of the "Winnings"

I've recently added functionality that pays the BOOKIE the stakes placed on wagers that did not pay out. This will be changing slightly tho as right now (see this post): http://addons.nfljunkies.com/thread...n-outcomes-that-do-not-pay-out.145/#post-4893

 

[SneakyDave]

So now this is more confusing to me, using that math. I'll use the RAMS for example, since that is current.

So in this basic example, these odds are extreme, but it is the Raiders we're talking about....
Raiders +30 (100 to 110)
Rams -30 (110 to 100)

Let's say somebody places a wager of $50 on the Raiders, with those outcomes, and the Raiders win the game, (for example).

The member would get (50 * 100) / 110 or $45 profit, and their stake ($50) returned. Is that right?

If they wagered $100 on the Raiders, they'd get $90 in profit, and their stake ($100) returned.

So, let's say if the Rams won the game, and scored 52 points on the Raiders, which they did, sorry.

If you wagered $50 on the Rams, you'd get $55 profit, plus your stake back.

If you wagered $50 on the Raiders, you'd lose your stake.

I guess my point is that I don't know why you'd have 100 to 110 odds or 110 to 100 odds on spread bets, because the spread bet makes it even odds, pretty much, right?

Wouldn't they normally be 100 to 100 odds on those spread bets? Or am I missing something.

I'm not worried about the bookie getting the juice or anything. I'm trying to figure out why, for spread bets, you'd have uneven odds.

 

[Bob]

Dave, you are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY over thinking things.

I (ME, MYSELF AND I) prefer to use VEGAS odds. You don't HAVE to. That is just me and my examples.

You can use 1 to 1 and 2 to 1 and 3 to 1 and 2 to 5. The MATH is the same on 1 to 1 as it is on 100 to 100.

 

[SneakyDave]

HA, yeah, you're right. I understood that 100 to 100 is the same as 1 to 1, or whatever, I just didn't know why you were going that route with a spread bet, but I think I'm picking up what you're laying down now.

 

[Bob]

I mainly do it because I grab realistic odds from a specific site (to maintain standards throughout the season for my site).

I also do it because 1 to 1 is sometimes TOO high of a payout... you may only want to payout $.33 cents to the dollar, so 100 to 300